The Removal of restraint happens in Revelation 9.

II Thessalonians 2:7-8 tells us something is currently restraining the Son of Apoleia and that's why the Abomination of Desolation hasn't happened yet and in turn the Parusia and Rapture can't happen till after that.  The use of the word "he" in translations is misleading, it's not necessarily any person doing the restraining, but you could in my view say the "restrainer" is the Fifth Trumpet Angel if you wanted to.

Revelation 11:7 and 17:8 both tell us that at least one of the Beasts ascends out of the Bottomless Pit aka the Abyss aka the Great Deep.  At the beginning of Revelation Chapter 9 the Abyss is locked but after the Fifth Trumpet is sounded it is opened and entities in that Abyss begin to leave.  Revelation 20 further tells us that in the future this is where Satan will be restrained for a Thousand years.

This argument is not dependent on identifying either Beast with any specific personage in Revelation 9, the facts I just laid out should be enough to make it obvious.  None the less I feel a strong argument can be made for Apollyon being the Son of Apoleia.

It annoys me that this simple answer to the Restrainer mystery is so rarely what Prophecy teachers argue for.  The Early Church Writers tended to think the Restrainer was Rome for some reason, today most Pre-Tribbers say it's the Holy Spirit to try and make this obviously Pre-Trib destroying passage compatible.  And the "Pre-Wrath" view of Chris White tends to say it's Michael doing what he does in Revelation 12 and Daniel 12 even though that makes no grammatical sense at all, not to mention how it makes no Chronological sense in the context of Pre-Wrath, that makes more sense as a Midway Point argument.

In his most recent Podcast while addressing Pre-Tribbers Chris White says that Matthew 24:38's description of people "eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage" makes no sense in a context where any of the Trumpets have already happened but specifically singled out the Fifth.  He makes a similar argument about the "peace and safety" from I Thessalonians 5:3.

The problem with that argument is Revelation 11:10.  I view that verse of Matthew 24 as that same three and a half day period, same with the "peace and safety" verse.  Doesn't matter how much bad apocalyptic stuff had already happened, people think it's over now.  And I still think the End Times deception will be partly based on people thinking the first half of the 7 year period is the second half.

If you think "as the days of Noah were" must mean nothing catastrophic had happened yet, I direct you to this post where I discus overlooked details of Genesis 6.
https://midseventiethweekrapture.blogspot.com/2018/08/the-flood-did-not-destroy-earth-it.html

The After Life and The Ressurection

One of the problems in the world today is that Casual Christianity looks at the after life in a way that is inherently Pagan. It’s not a matter of going to Heaven or Hell.

The perfect eternity we’re looking forward to is NOT contemporary Heaven, contemporary Heaven is going to be us giving an account before God of our lives, washing our Robes in the Blood of the Lamb. What we’re looking forward to is the Resurrection and the Millennium and then the New Heaven and New Earth. The Restoration of the Kosmos to how it was before Adam Sinned.

This is part of why I object to Preterisim and Amillennialism. It’s not just about Eschatology. A denial of the Literal fulfillment of the Millennium allows a Christian to still hold a Pagan view of the After life. And a denial of the literal Resurrection of believers defeats the point of the Resurrection of Christ.

I believe that Salvation can’t be lost, but I believe there are ramifications when a Christian sins, one of those I‘ll discus here. Because all saved during the Church Age have the opportunity to Reign with Christ, as Kings and Priests after the Order of Melchizedek. But not all will. We can’t lose our entrance into the Kingdom, but we can lose our Inheritance. There are also rewards for the good works we do, but some will get no rewards.

There are three Greek nouns translated Hell in the KJV rendering of the New Testament. While the Bible often uses different words for the same thing, these 3 names are all distinct entities.

1. Hades, is the equivalent of the Hebrew Sheol (The word for Hell in the Hebrew Bible). Prior to the Cross all of the Dead went there, not just the unsaved. Luke 16 reveals that is has two compartments, the Saved were comforted in Abraham’s Bosom.

2. Tartaros, this word appears only once, in 2 Peter 2:4. The Grammar of this particular verse is also messed up in the KVJ, because the KJV translators wanted to make an assumption about where it was located. SO here is how it should be.

“For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but delivered them into chains of darkness in Tartaros to be reserved unto judgment”.

Hades and Tartaros both I believe in a sense have geographical

locations within the Kosmos. Hades definitely being inside The Earth. But I say in a sense because if we ever were able to physically dig down there, I don’t think we’d see it with our four dimensional perception of reality. I believe they are there but in the other six dimensions, which we know are there but we can’t perceive in our current mortal fallen state.

Tartaros is often assumed to be also inside the Earth, and maybe it is, but I’m not so sure.

Tartaros is beyond any doubt the same place as The Abyss, the Bottomless Pit, their linked by the imagery of Chains and Darkness. In addition to the Genesis 6 Angels, that is also where Demons go when Christian cast them out of possessed people properly, also binding them. Revelation 9 says “And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.” Elsewhere in Revelation (1-3 and 12), Stars often symbolize Angels, so it’s often assumed the Star is the Him being given this Key. But this is a completely different part of Revelation, less symbolic and more literal. Every other Star in in the Seal-Trumpet-Veil judgments is always an astronomical object, not specially what we today have limited the meaning of a "Star" to, but still what it literally meant then. Given the context of verse 13, I believe the Angel who sounded the Trumpet is the one being given the Key. The term translated “Fall from” could simply mean descend or move from one location to another. It could simply mean some object in the Solar System, or further out in space, coming much closer to Earth then it currently is.

But that's a conjecture, it could still be inside the Earth like Hades/Sheol, or even a sub compartment of it. Jesus is also described as going to the Abyss during the three days he was dead (Romans 10:7, where it'd translated Deep in the KJV). Also Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28-33 have references to a Pit that The Antichrist goes into, there it seems like it's near or in Sheol.

3. Gehena, This word has it’s origin in the name of a fiery Garbage dumb in ancient Judea. But every time Jesus used it, it appears to be a synonym for “The Lake of Fire” not of Hades. This is the finale Damnation, the “Second Death” the ultimate perdition of the unsaved.

The terms “First Resurrection” and “Second Resurrection” are categories more so then a chronological sequence. The First is the saved and the Second the Unsaved.

“The First Resurrection” begins with Yeshua’s own. Remember during the three days and three nights he was “In the Belly of the Earth” he descended into Hades. Why? At least one reason was to get the people being kept in Abraham’s Bosom. Matthew 27:52 “And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, and came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

So as we can already see it doesn’t necessarily happen all at once. There is also the Resurrection of the Two Witnesses during the 70th Week. The saved who are part of the Church will be Resurrected at the “Rapture” (whether or not you view it as Pre-Trib, Post-Trib or Mid-Trib). And if any saved are left Un-Resurrected after the Beast is defeated, they’ll be Resurrected at the start of The Millennium.

“The Second Resurrection” Revelation 20 puts at the end of the Millennium, after Satan’s final defeat. But since The Beast and The False Prophet are cast alive into the Lake of Fire without any reference to being killed in Revelation 19, at the start of the Millennium, some have argued that those two are individuals who where allotted to experience the “Second Resurrection” early. Probably his resurrection is the healing of the mortal wound.

There is one area, where Yeshua’s Resurrection is different from ours (The rest of “The First Resurrection“) that I want to discus quickly. Some critics of The Bible I’ve encountered have suggested that Yeshua’s sacrifice on the Cross doesn’t mean anything since he knew he’d be Resurrected. But The Logos didn’t just become a Man temporarily, he became one permanently.

Revelation 5:5&6 “And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof. And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain.” It’s well known that Yeshua still had his wounds from the Crucifixion when he was walking on the Earth following The Resurrection via the Doubting Thomas story. And Zechariah 12 and Revelation 1 both tell us he’ll still be Pierced when he returns to be reunited with the Redeemed of Israel in Petra. But here we see it implied he’s Pierced right now at his Father’s right hand, even though he’s not in the physical realm.

None of the other Saved I believe will still have the wounds that caused their Death when their Resurrected, I can’t picture Rachel Scott walking around in the New Jerusalem with multiple gunshot wounds to her head, chest, arm and leg. That’s the permanent part of Yeshua’s sacrifice for us, he’s going to carry His wounds forever so we won’t have to carry ours.

The Seventh and Last Trumpet

 First I want to address those who refute the Seventh Trumpet view by claiming the "Last Trump" (1 Corinthians 15:52) being called the "Trump of God" (1 Thessalonians 4:16) means it can't be sounded by an Angel.  Everything in Heaven is of God, and the Seventh Trumpet being clearly separated from the rest in it's sounding makes it unique.  In Revelation 15 and 16 the Seven bowls of Gods Wrath are poured out by Angels, even though we all know the Wrath in question is Of God, the Trumpets are the same.

A debate exists over whether or not the "Last Trump" that signals the Rapture in Thessalonians, and Corinthians and Matthew 24 is the Seventh Trumpet of Revelation 11 or the Last Trumpet sounded on the Feast of Trumpets.

Chris White argues it's neither and that we should look at the Silver Trumpets of Numbers 10.

It is true that the Biblical Hebrew text does not explicitly link Trumpets to the First of Tishri feast in Leviticus 23:24, that's an assumption we make based on Trumpets being added in translation, and extra Biblical traditions about that day. Chris White however seems to assume the Trumpets affiliated with the First of Tishri are the Ram's Horns. But a book I have on Hebrew customs (by Ethan Allen) says Silver Trumpets and Shofar were both sounded on that day.

Numbers 10:10 does say the Silver Trumpets are to be sounded "Also in the day of your gladness, and in your solemn days, and in the beginnings of your months". Now "solemn days" in the Hebrew texts refers to the "appointed times' or High Holy Days, meaning all of them outlined in Leviticus 23. And the beginning of each month would also include the First of Tishri.

The single word translated "blowing of trumpets" in Leviticus 23:24 is T@ruw`ah (ter-oo-aw'); Noun Feminine, Strong #: 8643. Is used in Numbers 10:5&6 where it is translated "Alarm".
"When ye blow an alarm, then the camps that lie on the east parts shall go forward.
When ye blow an alarm the second time, then the camps that lie on the south side shall take their journey: they shall blow an alarm for their journeys."
In verse 7 it's a different word translated alarm, but one that is probably the root of the final syllable of Taruwah.

At any rate I'd agree we can't build solid doctrine on any extra Biblical assumptions about Rosh Hoshana. But this one may have more of a Biblical basis then he realized. The First of Tishri is the one day there is double the reason to sound those Trumpets. And the only thing we are told about it in Leviticus is a key word also used in Numbers 10 about blowing Trumpets.

Actually Psalm 81 I feel kind of refutes the claim that there is no Biblical basis for linking Trumpets to the First of Tishri.  In verse 3 Asaph wrote "Blow up the trumpet in the new moon, in the time appointed, on our solemn feast day."  The only day that is both a New Moon and one of the Leviticus 23 ordained major Feast Days is the First of Tishri.  Here though Shofar is used rather then the word for the Silver Trumpets.

I don't think we should distinguish between the Rams Horns and Silver Trumpets in terms of how they may symbolically point to Heavenly/Eschatology Trumpets. Whether it's the verses indisputably about The Rapture or the Seven Trumpets in Revelation. Earthly Trumpets needed to be made from separate materials for Earthly reasons, but the Heavenly Trumpets are probably not really made from any Earthly substance at all. Silver is Levitcully a symbol of Redemption, and Ram's Horns are taken from Sacrificial offerings.  So symbolically both point to Jesus as our Sin Offering, who's voice is sometimes described as "like a Trumpet".  And the New Testament only uses one Greek word for Trumpet.

Hosea 5:8 Poetically uses both words for Trumpet as if their synonyms. But the KJV renders one of them Cornet to avoid sounding redundant.

He's also wrong that the Trumpet themes through out the Prophets are always the Silver Trumpets.  Hosea 5:8 is the only time the Silver Trumpets are mentioend in the Porphetic Books.  And Psalm 98 the only time they're in the Psalms.  Both have the Shofar also in the same verse.  Every other Trumpet reference in the Psalms or Prophets it is the Shofar.  And Plenty seem linked to The Rapture/Day of The LORD.

I believe that the references to the Trumpets in Revelation are meant to draw on all the earlier Trumpet themes of Scripture. Both the Silver and the Rams Horns. Because I view Revelation as explaining the rest of Scripture, and unveiling all things that were before mysteries. Meaning if the Trumpet that signals the Rapture isn't in Revelation, then Revelation has arguably failed to serve part of it's purpose.

Post-Tirbbers often agree with seeing the Rapture in the same Revelation passages Mid-Tirbbers do, but make it compatible with their view by garbling the chronology of Revelation in ways that are ridiculous.  Those would also agree with my on the Seventh Trumpet being sounded on he First of Tishri, I would point out that there is no Biblical basis for God post Exodus ever returning to Tishri rather then Nisan years.

Of the passages outside Revelation viewed as being the most indisputably about The Rapture, a Trumpet sounding is the most nearly universal detail.  Matthew 24:31, 1 Thessalonians 4:16 and 1 Corinthians 15:52, and I feel the most solid Old Testament reference in Joel.  Yet Pre-Trib and Pre-Wrath people refuse to look for a Trumpet in their placement in Revelation, and Pre-Wrathers feel their position is proved by Rapture signs only used in the Olivite Discourse yet never by Paul.

Both Post-Tribbers and Mid-Trib/Pre-Wrath supporters love to refute the Pre-Trib argument that Matthew 24 isn't referring to the same coming/gathering as Paul by pointing out all the parallels between that account and Paul's from Thessalonians and Corinthians. There are at least 20. But what many either miss or ignore is that a number of those same parallels apply to the Seventh Trumpet in Revelation 11.

We have a Trumpet sounding followed by great voices in Heaven. The use of the word "Archangel" in Corinthians is a different from then when Jude uses it of Michael. It ends with an "n" making it technically plural in Greek.

We have The Four Cherubim declaring God's Wrath is come, in a way that makes clear it hadn't come before the 7th Trumpet.

We have talk about it now being the "Time of the Dead" and time to judge and reward the saints. That sounds like the Bema Judgment to me.

I also think "And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament" could correlate to "The sign of the Son of Man" being seen in the Heavens. One can argue the Ark of the New Testament is the Cross on which The Lamb's Blood was shed for our Sins.

There is lighting and another Earthquake. The Seventh Trumpet account lacks reference to the Sun or Moon being darkened. But this could be left over effect for the Fourth Trumpet, and/or when the Smoke form the Abyss covered The Earth following the Fifth.

Also there were no Chapter breaks originally, to Revelation 12's beginning is still the Seventh Trumpet.  The word Harpatzo is used, and stars fall from heaven.  And possibly a layer of meaning here is astronomical clues pointing to the New Moon of Tishri.

Then after the rest of 12 and 14 continue laying out the Mid-Trib drama, we come to 14.

The 144 Thousand are seen on Mt. Zion, and it sounds to me like they're in their Resurrected state, with talk of being "Redeemed from the Earth" and being the "First Fruits". I do not allegorize the 144 Thousand, they're a specific group of believer. But I do think their part of the Church and Resurrected already here. A better argument certainly then the weak one that the Multitude in Chapter 7 are Resurrected already.

And latter we have "And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of Man" in verse 14. And with it's Harvest imagery.

And further reading shows the pouring out of God's Wrath is still only about to happen.

And then supplemental to what follows the Seventh Trumpet, is what proceeds it. It seems to immediately follow the Resurrection and Rapture of the Two Witnesses. Again, I do not allegorize the Witnesses, they're Enoch and Elijah to me. But I do think it's possible their Rapture could have a connection to ours. Their being taken out of the Earth alive before are each seen as types of The Rapture after all.

I think there is more then enough connection between the Seventh Trumpet and the Last Trump to see them as connected.

Revelation 9:20 shows the Image of the Beast hasn't been set up yet. Because the Idols these people are being judged for worshiping "neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:". So the life like Image of the beast isn't here yet.

Actually, Revelation 9 is a major Death nail for the Pre-Wrath position. No damned individual should be able to Ascend out of the Bottomless Pit before it is unlocked. But the Pre-Wrath position needs this to be well after the Abomination of Desolation, which can't happen until after The Beast ascends out of the Bottomless Pit. We're told he's ascended out of it already when he kills The Two Witnesses.

I believe Revelation 9 is the Removal of The Restrainer.  As I explained in this blog's first post.

Pre-Wrath people usually insist the ministry of The Witnesses is the second half of the 70th week. But Malachi clearly says Elijah returns BEFORE the great and terrible Day of the LORD.

I've also decided I see Joel 2:1 as the Sixth Trumpet, what happens after it sounds has some clear parallels to what happens in Revelation 9:13 and up, with a bizarre Supernatural army of Fiery Horsemen.

And so Joel 2:15 I see as the Seventh Trumpet, where the people are Gathered and the Groom collects his Bride. Between them in verse 10 the Sun and Moon are described as being darkened.

I did a Google search on the subject, and it seems no one else has noticed this yet, Which surprises me. Many I've seen, like in J.R. Church's book on the Minor Prophets, link Joel Chapter 2 to the Fifth Trumpet, though to me that doesn't work quite as well. I don't like Allegorizeing the Locust of Revelation 9 into an Army, when the next Judgment is explicitly defined as an Army. To me the creatures let out of the Abyss are Demons taking temporary physical forms, like the ones they sometimes take from TransYughothian Ceremonial Magick rituals. That's the significance of The Smoke.

The Invading Army in Joel 2 is usually either taken as the Gog and Magog Invasion, or Armageddon. But to me it seems to be placed before The Rapture, which doesn't fit the latter. And I've become convinced that the former happens after the Millennium.

It seems people identifying as Pre-Wrath think a lot still happens between the Abomination of Desolation and the Rapture. Enough to account for months or even years. Basically, to them the Persecution of The Church the Matthew 24 Olivite Discourse describes happening before the Abomination of Desolation, and as correlating to the Fifth Seal, actually happens after the Abomination.

Paul in 2 Thessalonians 2 clears places the "Falling Away" before the Abomination of Desolation.  This falling Away is seen by Pre-Wrather as correlating to the Matthew 24 persecution.

There are two coming end times Persecutions I believe. As I explain in the "Great Tribulation" post.

I believe the sounding of the Seventh Trumpet is on the Feast of Trumpets.  So it's not either/or between those two options.

Why Pre-Trib and Pre-Wrath both fail

I was not quite as decided on this as I am now when I wrote the first draft of what's below.

I used to be firmly in what is called the Post-Trib camp. (Even though unlike many Post-Tribbers I've always been completely against Replacement Theology.)  And certainly never liked the Pre-Trib argument.  What Chuck Missler explains about the uniqueness of the Church alters my perspective however.  Once you understand that not all saved are part of The Church then the references to believers on the Earth during the Tribulation no longer inherently contradicts the Pre-Trib view. Chuck also seems certain that if you're not Pre-Trib on the Rapture your problem is Ecclesiology not Eschatology. Well I am the same as Chuck on Ecclesiology, yet I still have issues with the Pre-Trib view. I'm still not sold on the Pre-Trib argument, however rather then being firmly Post-Trib I'm now leaning towards a Mid-Trib, I had also considered the Pre-Wrath view.

First off, the Pre-Trib camp seems to consider Imminence their cornerstone argument. Verses where the Bible tells us to "Expect" The Return of Jesus at any moment.  Problem is the intent of those verses aren't about chronology, their about the attitude believers should take and how we should behave.  Pre-Tribbers insist it means that the Rapture must be the absolute next thing to happen Chronologically, even though plenty of Prophecies have already been fulfilled while we've been waiting (Israel Restored, the first portion of Isaiah 19 ect.) Now it's the Gog&Magog invasion that can't possibly occur until after the Rapture. But logically before 1948 they'd have had to say the same thing about Israel being reestablished. Then till 67 them reclaiming all of Jerusalem.

When my Dad first starting teaching me how to use a gun, he told me before even letting me touch it to always treat it like it's loaded, even when I know for certain it is not. The point of that instruction is to make sure I'm always very very very careful with it, which is a very smart approach to take. But it doesn't change the fact that an unloaded gun still needs to be loaded before you can actually shoot something with it.

The Bible verses that imply Imminence are there to tell us to behave like he can return at any moment, to before committing any Sin think "Is that what I want to be doing in the middle of when Jesus comes back?" and to motivate us to work tirelessly in spreading the Gospel and doing God's work by acting like we could run out of time at any time. After all, in a sense it does happen for you immediately when you die. But the fact remains that there are at least two Bible passages that make it clear the Rapture won't occur at least until after the "Abomination of Desolation".

Matthew 24's account of the Olivet Discourse reaches the "Abomination of Desolation" in verse 15. Then it goes on describing more End Times drama in very broad terms until verses 29-31 when Jesus (And Pre-Tribbers tend to ignore this) explicitly says

Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

This is clearly the same event described in 1 Thessalonians 4, and clearly described as AFTER a tribulation. And also in this narrative it seems to be clearly after the "Abomination of Desolation".  It has the coming in the clouds, the gathering, the Trumpet being sounded.  Some may consider that the Resurrection is mentioned disproved this being the same event.  Well 1 Corinthians 15:52 doesn't mention the gathering or the coming in the clouds, only the Trumpet and the Resurrection and the living in Christ being changed.

I should add that the term "elect" contrary to Calvinist assumptions is not always a synonym for the saved, in many places it seems to refer rather to Israel. Doug Hamp has written a book on that subject and been interviews about it on "Prophecy in The news". Both he and Gary are of course Pre-Trib, and they'd probably respond that this part of the Olivet Discourse isn't about The Rapture because it refers to the Elect. But regardless of what that one word strictly means, this passage still clearly uses a lot of common imagery with 1 Thessalonians 4, the Trumpet, the Clouds ect and so on.

The word Elect can refer to more then one thing, it's simply a word meaning "chosen". When Jesus returns on a White Horse at the end of the 70th week Israel will not be gathered to him, he'll be going to where Israel is in hiding.   Israel and The Church are both his "Elect" in different senses, we both have the opportunity to be part of very special covenants that not all of the Saved have the opportunity to be part of. With neither meaning would I consider how the Calvanist co-opt the word to fit their version of "predestination" valid.

The only other argument I've seen Pre-Tribbers try to prove this isn't the same as 1 Thessalonians 4 is that Jesus refers to sending many Angels, while Paul refers to the voice "The Archangel".  First of all it is perfectly consistent to say that many Angels gather while one Archangel is shouting.  Second the Greek text in Thessalonians is "Archangelon" which is technically plural.  So I feel that back up a Seventh Trumpet view, which refers to many voices in Heaven.

Pre-Wrathers and Post-Tribbers may feel Mathew 24 favors their model over Mid-Trib because a lot seems to happen between the Abomination and the Gathering.  It may seem like a lot happens, but it's all described pretty broadly, and sometimes a lot can happen in very little time.  To me this could all fit easily into the three and a half days the Two Witnesses are dead.

2nd Thessalonians Chapter 2.

First, many take the language of "By letter as from us" in verse 2 as referring to a letter falsely attributed to Paul. It is not, he's referring to people misunderstanding or outright misusing what he said in 1st Thessalonians Chapter 4. He certainly is referring to that exact same event when he says "the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him". Now he goes on to explain in no uncertain terms.

for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

I put "and" in bold, because some Pre-Tribbers like to insist only the first of these two things has to happen first.

The Pre-Trib camp likes to make this fit their view by insisting the "Restrainer" mentioned latter is The Holy Spirit. Even if it where, that doesn't undermine the clear chronological implication that Paul is unambiguously saying that the Gathering Together will NOT happen till AFTER the "Man of Sins" is revealed. Yet so many Pre-Tribbers insist the Church will never encounter that individual. That's part of the danger of the Pre-Trib view to me, The Bible gives us all these clues about his identity for a reason, the Church should be using them, not just insisting "We'll never meet him anyway".

Now, let's get into this "Restrainer" verse, first of all the KJV rendering in verse 7 is.

For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

There could possibly be translational issues with the phrase rendered "taken out of the way" but that's incidental.

It's "He who now letteth" is who is commonly called here the "Restrainer" Restrain is what the Greek word translated "letteth" actually means. The previous verse uses the same word in a different form and the KJV translated it "Withholdeth". In verse 6 it's a present tense verb, there it should be "restraining" and in verse 7 "letteth now let" should be "restrains will continue to do so".

The use of "he" in verse 7 is added by the translators, they're not in the Greek. It is "what" not "who" that identifies the restrainer in verse 6. Chuck Missler insists it's "what" only because it's Gender neutral. The Holy Spirit is never described with Gender Neutral pronouns, poetically he's feminine more often, but is also frequently masculine. However he never lacks gender. It could very well be an object not a personage.

Job makes clear God does restrain Satan, and many verses describe God as restraining Sin, and those verses get cited to prove this verse is referring to The Holy Spirit, but none of those other verses about restraint affiliate it with a specific person of The Trinity.

The Pre-Wrath camp believes The Restrainer is Michael. I agree with them that Daniel 12:1 and Revelation 12:7 correspond. But to define him taking an offensive against Satan as ceasing to restrain something is silly to me.

Revelation 20 says

And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.  And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, and cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season. .............. And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, and shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth

Being locked in The Abyss is what will restrain Satan during the Millennium. Right now Satan isn't restrained, but something else is which Paul alludes to. That removal of Restraint is in Revelation 9, when The Abyss is first opened.

I believe that the restrainer being removed refers to when the Abyss is opened in Revelation 9. I believe it's the lock keeping the Abyss sealed and the entities inside chained. Note, the word translated "perdition" in "Son of Predition" is Apolyea, a Greek word related to Apollyon, Apollyon is just the proper noun form. He is being restrained because he's in the Abyss, the removal of that restraint is what happens when the 5th trumpet is sounded.

Some I know object to viewing Apollyon as an evil entity however. But that's incidental, my view does not require viewing either the First or Second beast as being a specific personage in Revelation 9. The fact simply remains that The Abyss is unlocked and things restrained there are set free.

Revelation 11:7 and 17:8 both refer to " the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit". The death nail of the Pre-Wrath view (which places all the Trumpets after the Abomination of Desolation) is that no damned personage can ascendeth out of the abyss before it's unlocked.

I believe this is an idiom of The Beast's resurrection, when his mortal wound is healed. In 17:8 it's followed by "and goeth into perdition". The Beast and The False Prophet are in Revelation 19 cast alive into the Lake of Fire without apparently being killed first. I believe this implies that their early partakers of the Second Resurrection. Their also the first two personages sent there. No one else goes there till after The Millennium.

So I think it's possible both ascend out of The Abyss. I have studies that deal more with that.

Another problem Revelation 9 has for the Pre-Wrath view is verse 20. " that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:" The idols being worshiped as this time don't move or walk or hear. The lifelike Image of The Beast from Revelation 13 clearly has not been set up yet.

So to me, both these passages are insurmountable obstacles for the Pre-Trib view, and Pre-Wrath also. But I am very open to Mid-Trib/Seventh Trumpet.